CCleaner Cripples Application Load Times
Cimlite
Best thing is to clean out the prefetch yourself and only keeping basic stuff. Things like explorer.exe and programs that you actually *do* use a lot you might want to keep in there. Removing explorer.exe from the prefetch does noticibly slowdown the responce time in windows. You can try that yourself easily, just move it to another location. That said, cleaning out old "junk" that you either don't have any more or do not use more than once a month is not a bad thing. Laboraffe, I've heard good things about "pr0nmaster5000.exe"... where exactly can I get it? ;P
Cellar_Dweller
I agree with some of what he is saying but, there is a real good reason to clear out your Prefetch folder and the biggest reason is: Spyway, Trojans, Adaware. Many recent trojans, virus, spyware etc. will put something within the prefetch (It only makes sense) so that no matter what you clean up and if you forget the prefetch, which MOST people do when cleaning up trojans and the like forgetting this is in XP will soon reboot to see everything they thought they had cleaned up has since returned... LOL.
Mastertech
I'm not sure about the prefetcher really affecting you much either way, though. Unless you're crusing XP with a PII or older, I doubt a 1/2 second load difference is noticeable anyway. It is NOT a 1/2 second difference. It can be 10 seconds or more for some applications. Firstly, disabling prefetch and cleaning out your Prefetch folder does not 'cripple' Windows. It cripples Windows Boot and Application Load Times. Prefetch adds to your Windows bootup time (sometimes significantly) just so it can guess which applications you like to open often and give them a slight boost in opening times. This is a lie, no it does not. It does not load anything relating to an application until you load it! You don't understand how it works. It is NOT a cache! So you had another 10 seconds to your bootup time, to save 1 second on the loading time for say the 5-10 apps you open the most often. It does not work this way and you have no idea what you are talking about. In my experimentation over the years I've found that you can noticeable improve Windows performance with minimal impact on app loading times by disabling prefetch, setting Task Scheduler service to Disabled (prevents new prefetch data), and clearing out your prefetch folder. You have no idea what you are talking about and have obviously never tested this. 100% quicker ? 100% slower if you clean out the Prefetch folder ? Bullshit. I've cleaned out this folder completely, and never saw any sort of drop in performance, in any way. That is because you have never timed it. Try it sometime and you will see. The article gives a way to test it for yourself. "Thing is, Prefetch, will prefetch a lot of stuff you use briefly. I regulary find lots of setup.exe's, installs, etc.. from drivers, programs, etc.. that I've downloaded from the web. I download these programs to a separate partition, then burn off the contents to DVD, and delete the folder." No it does not. It does not cache ANYTHING. You don't undertand how prefetching works is why you are confused. It only creates a .pf for any application that is launched at least 3 times. Now, tell me how still having these setup.exe's, installs, etc.. in the prefetch folder, can be a good thing ? Surely, trying to prefetch something that isn't there anymore, is NOT a good thing ? You don't understand. The .pf files for applications that are not there are NOT cached! They do nothing but take up 14kb of space. Eventually the prefetcher will delete these files in the mean time they do nothing. If you uninstall a program that has an entry in the Prefetch folder, it stays in that Prefetch folder. How is this a good thing ? How is it a bad thing? The files are so small and will not be used and eventually cleaned. Uninstalled applications are NOT prefetched! Surely, it's better to check, on a regular basis, for entries that no longer exist ? Why bother even with the folder full of items (128) it maybe takes up 5MB. Who cares it is not worth your time to bother. Windows does this automatically. The prefetch cleaning option is not intended to increase performance but simply remove a run history of applications Instead it cripples load times!!! Why? To save 1MB of disk space?M/b>
Mastertech
I agree with some of what he is saying but, there is a real good reason to clear out your Prefetch folder and the biggest reason is: Spyway, Trojans, Adaware. Many recent trojans, virus, spyware etc. will put something within the prefetch (It only makes sense) so that no matter what you clean up and if you forget the prefetch, which MOST people do when cleaning up trojans and the like forgetting this is in XP will soon reboot to see everything they thought they had cleaned up has since returned... LOL. This is another myth. The .pf files are NOT executeable and are the only things in the Prefetch folder besides the layout.ini. So if a virus did put something in there an AV scanner will find it since it would not be a regular .pf file. Take a look for yourself. Cleaning the rest of the folders contents makes NO sense. Best thing is to clean out the prefetch yourself and only keeping basic stuff. Things like explorer.exe and programs that you actually *do* use a lot you might want to keep in there. No you want to leave ANY file in there for an installed application. Otherwise when you go to launch it you will be crippling it's load time.
majortom
Besides which If you run CCleaner then go and check your prefetch folder you will see that it doesn't delete everything .... just "old" data as implied by "Old Prefetch Data".... ho hum
Mastertech
That said, it wouldn't "cripple" Windows turning it off; just make it as slow as previous versions of Windows are in those regards basically. AGAIN. The article says it "cripples" APPLICATION LOAD TIMES NOT WINDOWS! Mastertech, I stand by my comments, which are derived from years of using XP on a variety of systems, and testing a range of options. I've been doing this for over 15 years and work daily for a PC OEM. I can tell you flat out you never tested this. What is scarey is your offer "tweaking" advice. I know prefetch is supposed to optimize boot layout, and speed up both boot times and application load times. That is the theory. No it is not a theory but a fact. However in practice, even after several weeks of allowing the Prefetcher to do its job unhindered (it needs 3 days to optimize layout and at least two application launches to optimize app launches), I found my bootup times were increasing, and my apps times were not noticeably any faster. Whatever, you never tested or timed this. For all I know you also had the Task Scheduler service disabled and prefetching as well. Anyone can test this with a stop watch. I don't need a "methodology" for measuring the success or failure of a feature - I use my own observation skills. Your "observations skills" are a joke and not factual nor tested. Show me some numbers and a test I can reproduce here. You don't have them because you never tested this. I guarantee you any "test" you come up will show prefetching will improve load times or I will point out what you are doing wrong and why it was not working. ever I suggest people try the disabled prefetch/disabled Task Scheduler scenario for themselves and see the difference. I found it a clear-cut case against using the prefetcher. This article gives a clear way to test this. Why not try it before spreading more bad advice that you don't even bother to test. You can't tell people to "notice" something. They need to time it. You haven't found anything but your ignorance in not testing or understanding how prefetching works. People like you that spread these myths is what is wrong with the Internet and why people have unoptimized systems with bad advice Besides which If you run CCleaner then go and check your prefetch folder you will see that it doesn't delete everything .... just "old" data as implied by "Old Prefetch Data".... ho hum You are clueless. The article clearly explains it deletes prefetch files over two weeks old and why this is stupid. If the NTFS last access date is turned off it deletes them all. PLEASE read the article and try to comprehend it.
TSThomas
"AGAIN. The article says it "cripples" APPLICATION LOAD TIMES NOT WINDOWS!" Calm down a bit; re-read what I wrote. You seem to have misinterpreted it, I said just that "make it as slow as previous versions of Windows are *in those regards* basically".
TweakHound
TSThomas - Prefetching is on for a reason; it's faster. Disabling or clearing it is counterproductive with no real benefit - it doesn't save a noticeable amount of memory nor does it improve performance - it can't really. Well said!
Mastertech
Your rabid responses, and your 'Optimize XP' guide which is basically one giant ad for various utilities and sponsored links tells the story by itself mate. You're lack of knowledge on how prefetching works and your inclusion of numerous urban legend "tweaks" says it all. I offer descriptions in my guides and encourage people to experiment. I don't ram "technical facts" down peoples' throats. You are right, I test things and find out how they really work before misleading people and can back it up with facts, when they don't understand and actual evidence. Simply put: Windows is already optimized out of the box for the average user. The reason we tweak it is for users who want full control over the functions of their XP, and who don't just accept that MS knows best. Out of the box Windows has alot of fluff turned on that only slows the system down. The concept behind the prefetcher is simple: It preloads information in anticipation of loading certain applications at a later point. It preloads/pages this information at some earlier point - applications don't magically load faster when prefetch is enabled, a portion of them has been preloaded into memory at some earlier stage. You are 100% wrong. Prefetching loads NOTHING before hand. It traces an applications startup and after 3 times creates a .PF file. From then on out when you go to load that application, the first thing Windows does is look in the Prefetch folder and if a .pf file exists it loads all the files that are referenced in the file at the same time. Open a .PF file and look at it yourself. All it is, is a list of file locations. By default during an application startup some of those files might wait on another one before they are loaded. With prefetching enabled they are all loaded simultaneously, thus applications load faster. If you don't believe me ask Microsoft. Your lack of knowledge on the subject makes this scarey that you offer people incorrect advice. I suggest you speak with Microsoft.
Mastertech
@ Mastertech said: "I've been doing this for over 15 years and work daily for a PC OEM." Well there you go, shot yourself in the foot there, 99.99% of people working for large OEMs know fook all about PC's. I've been woking with PCs (support + software Dev) for a lot longer than 15 years and everyone knows that. As have I but I have only worked for a PC OEM for 15 years. #1 it is not a "large" OEM. #2 None of which changes how Prefetching works. Show me ONE document to support how you think Prefetching works as I can provide many to show how it actually does.
Mastertech
I see. So the link you yourself provide in your guide, and is a Microsoft-authored link is wrong, but you are right? Yes. Your understanding of Prefetch is clearly wrong. Prefetch must preload data at some point as part of its optimization of application load times, and that is borne out by both Microsoft sources, and prominent MS experts. As you say, it is scary that you are offering tweaking advice. It is NOT MY understanding but how Prefetching works. It does preload the data right after you click on the icon to launch the application. What you are implying is ridiculous. Files for 128 applications are preloaded at windows startup? Get a clue. Your performance figures are derived from Microsoft comparing a stock standard XP install running prefetch. My performance figures are derived from testing with a stopwatch. However a customized XP install as per my guide, which doesn't actually disable prefetch (the Prefetch key remains =3 in the registry), but removes the .pf files, and disables Task Scheduler to prevent their recreation, results in faster boot times and no noticeable decline in app launch times. Try this yourself before continually refuting it, it does work. No it doesn't and you're a fool for believing it does. Go do some real research and test things before posting BS. People like you are what is wrong with the internet. You provide BS advice consitently with out verifying it. Prefetch caters to the average user who doesn't mind the fact that MS has chosen to give them bootup load times in return for shorter app load times. You are so clueless on this you have no idea. Try timing this instead of guessing fool. I am saying I don't want that tradeoff, and in my actual experience (not regurgitating technical information incorrectly from MS sites), I find that my method results in faster bootup and no noticeable reduction in app load times. Right.... Your method is what you get when people with no knowledge of how something works doesn't bother to test it and just posts assumptions. Your rude, abusive, incorrect ranting has shown that you are more interested in getting on the latest "myth busting" bandwagon, rather than finding new ways of getting better performance in games and XP - which is what my site is devoted to. None of my tweaks hurt performance or system stability, and I continue to stand by that. I am interested in providing ACCURATE information not snake oil. Don't be a fool and try testing something before you make idiotic claims. Try to stop being ignorant and do some research.
Mastertech
Thanks for the discussion, and let's just agree to disagree. In your dreams. I will continually point out where you are wrong because I can back up what I am talking about with reproduceable evidence. Show me one test that proves prefetching works how you claim. I have little if any regard for your work now - far less than I did before. I've never had any regard for your work because it was always filled with misleading innaccurate advice. Of all the tweakers I can name, Thomas McGuire is perhaps one of the last few for whom I have high regard, particularly for his contributions to game tweaking, as well as assorted tech sites like HardOCP which explore new discoveries. It doesn't mean he understand prefetching any better then you do. Using alarmist terms like "crippling windows" - when I know for a fact that is not the case - and flip-flopping when MS' own documents reveal that prefetch must preload data at some point (I would suggest boot time seems logical based on my observations). Good going. You can't even comprehend the facts and it does cripple application load times, try testing it instead of defending your hopelessly wrong position. The only flip-flop is your ignorance on Prefetching. You go from clueless to foolish. That MSDN article you referenced is not accurate, I suggest you get a quote from the XP developement team if you don't believe people like Mark Russinovich. For the record, I have never had any problems admitting I am wrong, adjusting my guides accordingly when new facts come to light, or testing/user feedback tells me things are not working. Many of the myths you speak of I have already updated since the start of the year in my guide indicating that they are useless (but harmless in any case). You hardly research any facts before you post them. If you spent half the time doing so you would understand how prefetching works and not be arguing with me about it. At the same time, unlike your ranting, I have no problems with my readers using other guides and deciding for themselves what works and what doesn't. Unlike you I don't label my guide 'incompatible with other guides' to try to wrangle traffic my way. I don't accept your guide as fact, but it seems harmless enough. It's not the way I do things, but that's fine. I have a big problem with my readers using other guides fille with inaccurate and misleading information. Your ignorance on prefetching furthers my point. This brings up another point I don't really care what you do but you seem to be obsessed with me, why is that? The proof is in the pudding as they say. Everyone who has used my TGTC seems to be happy with the newfound speed and stability, and indeed on a wide range of systems I have installed and used for myself and friends, it's the same case. Fast loading times, fast app launch times, better performance in games and rock-solid stability. Ignorance is bliss. Disabling prefetching or clearing the prefetch folder does not undo any other tweaks in your guides that actually work. It also does not affect stability in any way. It does however cripple application load times. Like I said try really testing this and stop blowing hot air around. Get a clue and do some research, you will thank me later but never admit it.
Mastertech
My performance figures are derived from testing with a stopwatch. I don't know where to even start, here. other than find a way to stop myself laughing. Try it yourself you might learn something. Go do some real research and test things before posting BS. People like you are what is wrong with the internet. You provide BS advice consitently with out verifying it. Yes kids, lets all do our "Research" with a stopwatch. Have you even tried this yet? Accurate information ? Lmao !! You have Norton Antivirus, and Trend bloody micro, under your anti-virus recommendations. ANY savvy person will know that Kaspersky is the best. And what about Anti-Vir ? For Free, it Certainly beats anything you've mentioned on your shit site. Your whole "Tweak" website is just a complete joke. A whole page of sheer arrogance, rather than helpful advice. Ah, comprehension helps so does reading. Those are not "recommended", what is, is an updated antivirus program that is ICSA certified. Your opinions on Kaspersky are hardly factual and it can hardly be considered the "best". Anti-Vir does not automatically update or include a boot time scan. Interesting you are deflecting the prefetching discussion as you must have discovered what I am saying to be true and you are not man enough to admit it.
