MSI NVIDIA Nforce2 Mobo Hardware Issues...
download off his MSN community page, it's alot faster. . . .
This topic was started by cappy_c,
I'm running the NVIDIA NForce2 Chipset on an MSI K7N2G mainboard which I purchased recently, along with 512 MB of 266MHz FSB PC2100 DDR memory and an AMD AthlonXP 2200+ processor (1.8GHz actual), in vain hopes of creating a "screamin' machine" that would allow my passions for music and graphics to achieve new heights. Of course, it also would have been nice to have enjoyed a game of "Warbirds III" or "Need for Speed, High Stakes," or any number of good 3d games every once in a while, but this was not to be.
The only way I was able to come to any sort of victory in this situation was to LOSE...but it's an achievement less deserving of a "victory dance" than Sammy Sosa's hitting a homer with a corked bat.
By that I mean that I had to "dumb-down" my system to points dumber than dumb. I tried every way I could think of to stop the spontaneous restarts and the annoying "STOP: (0x000000D1) IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL" bluescreen errors. These errors almost always seemed to be related to networking, memory or IDE interface devices (nvnet.sys, tcpip.sys, ntfs.sys, etc.). The only solution I was able to find was almost worse than the problem I'm trying to solve, but I won't get into that until a little later.
I have the following hypothesis: It seems that the Nforce2 NVIDIA MEMORY CONTROLLER drivers direct programs like IE, WS_FTP, Eudora Pro, proprietary and XP CD-RW software, Defrag, some games, and other programs to access physical memory blocks or paged memory blocks which they have no permission to access, or that do not exist, etc.
I have searched on Google, AltaVista, Lycos, etc. for DAYS UPON DAYS trying to find a workable solution to these problems, with no help in sight. Also, as I am neither qualified nor experienced enough to futz around with system devices or device drivers that controll memory access behavior, I have given up on that route entirely.
The only solution that I was able to come up with was to reinstall Windows XP on a new NTFS partition (clean install with no peripherals attached), DISABLE ALL ONBOARD NVIDIA HARDWARE upon first detection by Windows XP's "Add New Hardware Wizard," and then to install each peripheral, each 3rd party device driver and each program separately, taking time in between each installation to create well-defined system restore points along the way, just in case I encountered the same errors.
Since disabling the NVIDIA hardware components, my system has been ROCK SOLID...I have not had ONE, NOT ONE, system failure or crash of any type...so far, for about 72 hours straight (my PC is left on constantly). The one drawback: no video acceleration of any sort, whatsoever, beyond what Windows XP can do on its own. I can only run VGA graphics in 32 bit color at 800 x 600 pixels (XP standard), no higher, no lower. So, graphics and gaming are out of the question entirely.
In short, I have this "Great", "the Best on the Market," "Stunning Graphics," mobo with a chipset that can't seem to get it's act together for long enough to ray-trace a gnat, because it misallocates memory or mishandles IRQs or does generally naughty things to my network and filesystem handlers or both or all three, I don't know anymore, I'm just so friggin' pissed-off I could scream!!!!!
Anyway, I installed a generic Diamond net card that I had lying around in a drawer gathering dust, but which actually still works (and a damned sight better than the NVIDIA one...which is why I am able to access the Internet now) and also an old SB Live soundcard, so that I can "tune-out" while searching for yet more non-solution solutions to my hardware dilemmas.
Here's my two bits on the whole shebang: Either I have purchased a bum mobo (which is unlikely, since I exchanged the first MSI K7N2G I bought for the same model), or I have a bad processor (also unlikely, as I'm not having problems with anything after disabling the mobo's onboard NVIDIA hardware) or NVIDIA has seemingly created a set of products in the Nforce2 chipset and its drivers that do not work in concert with Windows XP, even though they are married with mainboards that support XP processors and purport to be 100% XP compatible (like the MSI K7N2G line). If NVIDIA were smart, they would open a very user-friendly and helpful channel for users like us, and release new MICROSOFT SIGNED drivers for the Nforce2 chipset in an attempt to garner some goodwill in their customer care abilities. Otherwise, they run the serious risk of losing future and current customers. I know that I'll probably never buy anything that says MSI or NVIDIA on it again in the future, unless this problem is solved DEFINITIVELY and VERY SOON.
If anyone knows of a solution...please, by all means, let us know.
The only way I was able to come to any sort of victory in this situation was to LOSE...but it's an achievement less deserving of a "victory dance" than Sammy Sosa's hitting a homer with a corked bat.
By that I mean that I had to "dumb-down" my system to points dumber than dumb. I tried every way I could think of to stop the spontaneous restarts and the annoying "STOP: (0x000000D1) IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL" bluescreen errors. These errors almost always seemed to be related to networking, memory or IDE interface devices (nvnet.sys, tcpip.sys, ntfs.sys, etc.). The only solution I was able to find was almost worse than the problem I'm trying to solve, but I won't get into that until a little later.
I have the following hypothesis: It seems that the Nforce2 NVIDIA MEMORY CONTROLLER drivers direct programs like IE, WS_FTP, Eudora Pro, proprietary and XP CD-RW software, Defrag, some games, and other programs to access physical memory blocks or paged memory blocks which they have no permission to access, or that do not exist, etc.
I have searched on Google, AltaVista, Lycos, etc. for DAYS UPON DAYS trying to find a workable solution to these problems, with no help in sight. Also, as I am neither qualified nor experienced enough to futz around with system devices or device drivers that controll memory access behavior, I have given up on that route entirely.
The only solution that I was able to come up with was to reinstall Windows XP on a new NTFS partition (clean install with no peripherals attached), DISABLE ALL ONBOARD NVIDIA HARDWARE upon first detection by Windows XP's "Add New Hardware Wizard," and then to install each peripheral, each 3rd party device driver and each program separately, taking time in between each installation to create well-defined system restore points along the way, just in case I encountered the same errors.
Since disabling the NVIDIA hardware components, my system has been ROCK SOLID...I have not had ONE, NOT ONE, system failure or crash of any type...so far, for about 72 hours straight (my PC is left on constantly). The one drawback: no video acceleration of any sort, whatsoever, beyond what Windows XP can do on its own. I can only run VGA graphics in 32 bit color at 800 x 600 pixels (XP standard), no higher, no lower. So, graphics and gaming are out of the question entirely.
In short, I have this "Great", "the Best on the Market," "Stunning Graphics," mobo with a chipset that can't seem to get it's act together for long enough to ray-trace a gnat, because it misallocates memory or mishandles IRQs or does generally naughty things to my network and filesystem handlers or both or all three, I don't know anymore, I'm just so friggin' pissed-off I could scream!!!!!
Anyway, I installed a generic Diamond net card that I had lying around in a drawer gathering dust, but which actually still works (and a damned sight better than the NVIDIA one...which is why I am able to access the Internet now) and also an old SB Live soundcard, so that I can "tune-out" while searching for yet more non-solution solutions to my hardware dilemmas.
Here's my two bits on the whole shebang: Either I have purchased a bum mobo (which is unlikely, since I exchanged the first MSI K7N2G I bought for the same model), or I have a bad processor (also unlikely, as I'm not having problems with anything after disabling the mobo's onboard NVIDIA hardware) or NVIDIA has seemingly created a set of products in the Nforce2 chipset and its drivers that do not work in concert with Windows XP, even though they are married with mainboards that support XP processors and purport to be 100% XP compatible (like the MSI K7N2G line). If NVIDIA were smart, they would open a very user-friendly and helpful channel for users like us, and release new MICROSOFT SIGNED drivers for the Nforce2 chipset in an attempt to garner some goodwill in their customer care abilities. Otherwise, they run the serious risk of losing future and current customers. I know that I'll probably never buy anything that says MSI or NVIDIA on it again in the future, unless this problem is solved DEFINITIVELY and VERY SOON.
If anyone knows of a solution...please, by all means, let us know.
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uhm do you seriously think he overclocked his memory? I'm sure he has other problems.
Anyway, I'm sorry I can't help you out, but it's really horrible which problems many nF2 users are reporting. I know there are many folks around who don't run into any problems with their nForce2, but actually looking into the forums of nforcershq.com made me believe that it must be luck to get a nforce system running without troubles. I can remember the times when everyone shouted at Via because their chips and drivers would be those with the most bugs and biggest variety of problems. I think nowadays NVidia shows that it can be even worse. I was thinkin of buying a nF2 as well, but well, maybe I should wait for KT600 to arrive.
Anyway, I'm sorry I can't help you out, but it's really horrible which problems many nF2 users are reporting. I know there are many folks around who don't run into any problems with their nForce2, but actually looking into the forums of nforcershq.com made me believe that it must be luck to get a nforce system running without troubles. I can remember the times when everyone shouted at Via because their chips and drivers would be those with the most bugs and biggest variety of problems. I think nowadays NVidia shows that it can be even worse. I was thinkin of buying a nF2 as well, but well, maybe I should wait for KT600 to arrive.
I'm no Doc Overclock.
First of all, even the most recent BIOS for the K7N2G doesn't allow the best tweakability. It allows only a FSB range of 100MHz - 200MHz in full manual mode (in 1MHz increments). You can OC your DRAM up to a maximum of a 1:2 ratio (2x) of the current CPU operating FSB (which comes out to be a very strange 267MHz when running the CPU at 133MHz, don't ask me why). Additionally, for some unknown reason (and I have researched this in depth) you can't OC an AthlonXP 2200+ (TB) easily.
I tried to OC the CPU when I first bought the mobo using several different multiplier and FSB settings. If the FSB is set for 100MHz or 133MHz with no multiplier settings, the CPU posts fine. Anything other than these settings does not work, including a standard 166MHz FSB with no multiplier (what a load of crap!).
From the research I've gathered, it requires a lot of fine tweaking of the FSB versus multiplier versus voltage adjustment to get the 2200+ TB to OC at all. Even when it works, there is only a slight performance gain (from 1.8MHz to 1.9MHz, respectively). Since, there are 100 to the twelfth power possible configurations in manual FSB mode (that's 100 trillion permutations, folks), I neither have the time, nor the wearwithall to attempt such a ludicrous undertaking.
So, unless you're completely unwilling to run at 1.8GHz (a full 19% less than AMD says is possible without OCing the CPU), just forget OCing the 2200+ altogether.
All this having been said, I'm still looking for help...if anyone knows anything.
First of all, even the most recent BIOS for the K7N2G doesn't allow the best tweakability. It allows only a FSB range of 100MHz - 200MHz in full manual mode (in 1MHz increments). You can OC your DRAM up to a maximum of a 1:2 ratio (2x) of the current CPU operating FSB (which comes out to be a very strange 267MHz when running the CPU at 133MHz, don't ask me why). Additionally, for some unknown reason (and I have researched this in depth) you can't OC an AthlonXP 2200+ (TB) easily.
I tried to OC the CPU when I first bought the mobo using several different multiplier and FSB settings. If the FSB is set for 100MHz or 133MHz with no multiplier settings, the CPU posts fine. Anything other than these settings does not work, including a standard 166MHz FSB with no multiplier (what a load of crap!).
From the research I've gathered, it requires a lot of fine tweaking of the FSB versus multiplier versus voltage adjustment to get the 2200+ TB to OC at all. Even when it works, there is only a slight performance gain (from 1.8MHz to 1.9MHz, respectively). Since, there are 100 to the twelfth power possible configurations in manual FSB mode (that's 100 trillion permutations, folks), I neither have the time, nor the wearwithall to attempt such a ludicrous undertaking.
So, unless you're completely unwilling to run at 1.8GHz (a full 19% less than AMD says is possible without OCing the CPU), just forget OCing the 2200+ altogether.
All this having been said, I'm still looking for help...if anyone knows anything.
yes I am serious ...
I have cheap RAM which is really good but sometime there is an end ...
it is FSB266 @ 2-2-2-5-1 an I tweaked it to FSB170 @ 2-3-2-5-1 but there is the end ... if I put one single MHZ more ... it runs but not 100% stable I always wondered why my PC crashed from time to time ... till I found out that it was the RAM ... thats why I posted this.... if XP gives different error without any reason it somehow a unstable component ... OK it is not the RAM but it was an option ...
I have cheap RAM which is really good but sometime there is an end ...
it is FSB266 @ 2-2-2-5-1 an I tweaked it to FSB170 @ 2-3-2-5-1 but there is the end ... if I put one single MHZ more ... it runs but not 100% stable I always wondered why my PC crashed from time to time ... till I found out that it was the RAM ... thats why I posted this.... if XP gives different error without any reason it somehow a unstable component ... OK it is not the RAM but it was an option ...
With my MSI board ive yet to encounter a problem like that
BUT, I do have memory problems, this board doesnt like infenion / generic ram. I loaded the newest BIOS and the problem semi went away, turns out my power supply isnt strong enough and I need to bump up to a 390 watt one, since then, no problems.
My advice to you my friend
A) Update BIOS,
Memory, replace and test with new ram
C) Reset your BIOS to default configuration
BUT, I do have memory problems, this board doesnt like infenion / generic ram. I loaded the newest BIOS and the problem semi went away, turns out my power supply isnt strong enough and I need to bump up to a 390 watt one, since then, no problems.
My advice to you my friend
A) Update BIOS,
Memory, replace and test with new ram
C) Reset your BIOS to default configuration
Infenion, and some generic brand shit
I have the latest Award BIOS from MSI for the K7N2G (MS-6750) Mobo. So, that's not the problem. I can't afford new DRAM right now, so that's out of the question, at least for the time being. Also, I have loaded and re-loaded the BIOS defaults many times, either using the "Load BIOS Defaults" option, or by resetting the CMOS jumper. The bluescreen STOP errors always occur when the onboard NVIDIA hardware is enabled, regardless of BIOS or any other settings. Quite frankly, I'm stumped. FUBAR, eh?
Any other scintillant ideas?
Any other scintillant ideas?
I have a MSI K7n2-L and using the 2.03 Nforce driver and i've got no problems at all. At the beginning I was using cheap memory which caused the same problems as described above IRQ_Not_Less...... Then i bought Infineon RAM and now my system runs perfectly. So I think you should buy new RAM.
Cappy C.....
Your problem may well be your memory .... but even if it isn't....
I am using an Abit NF7-S board and do NOT have your problems -- and I'm using Win2k rather than WinXP ....
but when I build a system (always for gaming) I avoid issues like you are raising by turning OFF ACPI and forcing interrupts individually. No IRQ sharing done by ACPI helps immeasurably to avoid the kinds of issues you are discussing (assuming no hardware problems, like poor memory).
Turn OFF ACPI by pressing at the beginning of an install and selecting "Standard PC" from the resulting menu. Install your OS normally thereafter. As an extra precaution, if I am not using onboard stuff (I use the nVidia onboard sound because it is excellent, but not the LAN because I can't seem to get the drivers loaded correctly), add the cards after the OS is installed.
These are *old* tips, there's nothing new here, but sometimes we need to remind ourselves that the older ways are occasionally the better ones.
I agree with your underlying premise that the nVidia chipset seems a little "premature", as if all the bugs and details aren't quite ready for prime time. But my system (after several rebuilds) is now up, running, and rock solid. I use Corsair PC400 memory and an ATI Radeon 9800 Pro.
Hope this helps.
Pers
Your problem may well be your memory .... but even if it isn't....
I am using an Abit NF7-S board and do NOT have your problems -- and I'm using Win2k rather than WinXP ....
but when I build a system (always for gaming) I avoid issues like you are raising by turning OFF ACPI and forcing interrupts individually. No IRQ sharing done by ACPI helps immeasurably to avoid the kinds of issues you are discussing (assuming no hardware problems, like poor memory).
Turn OFF ACPI by pressing at the beginning of an install and selecting "Standard PC" from the resulting menu. Install your OS normally thereafter. As an extra precaution, if I am not using onboard stuff (I use the nVidia onboard sound because it is excellent, but not the LAN because I can't seem to get the drivers loaded correctly), add the cards after the OS is installed.
These are *old* tips, there's nothing new here, but sometimes we need to remind ourselves that the older ways are occasionally the better ones.
I agree with your underlying premise that the nVidia chipset seems a little "premature", as if all the bugs and details aren't quite ready for prime time. But my system (after several rebuilds) is now up, running, and rock solid. I use Corsair PC400 memory and an ATI Radeon 9800 Pro.
Hope this helps.
Pers
I am receiving these blue screens too (till now tcpip.sys and ntfs.sys errors) and unwanted restarts. I am running Windows XP Pro and I have nVidia as well (the Nvidia GeForce4 Ti4200) and a 648 max (msi-6585) ATX mainboard.
The driver for Nvidia is signed by Microsoft, because when I look into the properties of the nVidia adapter, it says: Microsoft Windows Hardware Compatibility Publisher, driver version: 4.4.0.3
Cappy_c.. are you still error free with the nVidia hardware disabled? And why do you think it has something to do with nVidia in combination with MSI?
I really want a solution for this annoying problem as well.. :(
The driver for Nvidia is signed by Microsoft, because when I look into the properties of the nVidia adapter, it says: Microsoft Windows Hardware Compatibility Publisher, driver version: 4.4.0.3
Cappy_c.. are you still error free with the nVidia hardware disabled? And why do you think it has something to do with nVidia in combination with MSI?
I really want a solution for this annoying problem as well.. :(
I've been having similar problems with my computer, also a MSI K7N2. BSODs all over the place. It initially was running fine for about a month, then I happend to check my dxdiag screen and noticed that it was registering my processor as an XP 1500+ instead of a 2100+ so I decided to go into the BIOS and see if I could fix it to detect correctly. I got ahold of some specs for the 2100+ (1.733 GHz, 13X133 FSB, 1.60V core and max op temp of 90C) and tried to set the multiplier manually. Computer wouldn't boot after that, would give some beep code until I turned it off, pulled, clearing with the Jumper didn't seem to work either, so I popped out the battery, let it sit for about 10 Sec and put the battery back in (I did make sure the PSU was off and the flea power was gone before I tried either one)
It booted OK after that, and even detected as XP 2100+, but was having these IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL blue screens (was getting spontanious reboots until I found about about winXP's command to reboot on error and disabled it). I tried changing around the ram, that didn't fix anything (cause I had them in the slots to dual channel it), replaced the RAM with a matched set of generic PC2100 that I happened to have (also two 512 sticks) and that seemed to fix the BSODs, but now the computer will hard lock if I try to do anything that makes full use of the CPU (like SWG, or EQ, or Seti@home within about 5 min), runs fine for applications, but I play games, and have been gameless for the last week or so and am going into withdrawals.
I did a complete format and re-install of winXP last night, loaded all the latest drivers for video card and all the windows updates for XP and SP1 (minus Q811493 which has caused problems for me before) and it's still doing the lockups with full CPU useage. Tried in Safemode and it did the same thing, so I am thinking it's a hardware issue.
Since this all started when I tried to get the CPU to register as what it was instead of an AMD XP +1500 I tried underclocking it today to see how that would work. Set the multiplyer down to 12.5X and Core voltage down one notch (I think it was 1.57V, don't quite remember and can't look at the BIOS right now and type at the same time)
That seemed to work better, was able to run Seti@home for probably about an hour without locking up (didn't try SWG or EQ yet). I did get a BSOD when using IE which told me that NVnet.sys had attempted to write to read only memory Stop 0X000000BE.
A search on Google for NVnet.sys brought me to this thread, hope my info helps, and would appreciate any other advice anyone might have to offer to help with these problems.
Here's my system specs:
MSI K7N2 Delta-ILSR
nVidia NForce 2 Ultra 400 Chipset
AMD XP 2100+
1024 MB PC2100 DDRAM (generic)
MSI Ti4200 (Detinator 45.23)
Maxtor 60GB drive
Western Digital Caviar 120GB Drive (8 MB buffer)
ALink 20X10x40 CD burner
Pioneer DVD drive
Antec True Power 550W PSU
It booted OK after that, and even detected as XP 2100+, but was having these IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL blue screens (was getting spontanious reboots until I found about about winXP's command to reboot on error and disabled it). I tried changing around the ram, that didn't fix anything (cause I had them in the slots to dual channel it), replaced the RAM with a matched set of generic PC2100 that I happened to have (also two 512 sticks) and that seemed to fix the BSODs, but now the computer will hard lock if I try to do anything that makes full use of the CPU (like SWG, or EQ, or Seti@home within about 5 min), runs fine for applications, but I play games, and have been gameless for the last week or so and am going into withdrawals.
I did a complete format and re-install of winXP last night, loaded all the latest drivers for video card and all the windows updates for XP and SP1 (minus Q811493 which has caused problems for me before) and it's still doing the lockups with full CPU useage. Tried in Safemode and it did the same thing, so I am thinking it's a hardware issue.
Since this all started when I tried to get the CPU to register as what it was instead of an AMD XP +1500 I tried underclocking it today to see how that would work. Set the multiplyer down to 12.5X and Core voltage down one notch (I think it was 1.57V, don't quite remember and can't look at the BIOS right now and type at the same time)
That seemed to work better, was able to run Seti@home for probably about an hour without locking up (didn't try SWG or EQ yet). I did get a BSOD when using IE which told me that NVnet.sys had attempted to write to read only memory Stop 0X000000BE.
A search on Google for NVnet.sys brought me to this thread, hope my info helps, and would appreciate any other advice anyone might have to offer to help with these problems.
Here's my system specs:
MSI K7N2 Delta-ILSR
nVidia NForce 2 Ultra 400 Chipset
AMD XP 2100+
1024 MB PC2100 DDRAM (generic)
MSI Ti4200 (Detinator 45.23)
Maxtor 60GB drive
Western Digital Caviar 120GB Drive (8 MB buffer)
ALink 20X10x40 CD burner
Pioneer DVD drive
Antec True Power 550W PSU
